Hello Tech & Hardware forum

I'm setting out to buy not one, but two mid-range gaming PC's. I see no reason why they shouldn't be identical.

I've done some preliminary googling etc. and put together builds from MSY. All thoughts appreciated!

CPU Intel i5-3570K 227
MB Asus P8Z77-V-Pro 215
RAM Patriot Viper 16G Kit 2133(8Gx2) 135
GPU 3G 7950 Sapphire OC 324
HDD1 Samsung 840 Series SATA3 (250GB) 195
HDD2 Samsung 840 Series SATA3 (250GB) 195
HDD3 WD Black SATA3 2TB FAEX 165
DISC LG SATA Blu-Ray Writer 79
PSU Seasonic?
CASE Coolermaster?
Heatsink Noctua?

Currently 1535 + PSU/Case.

In particular, any thoughts on:

Storage: I thought the box would be a lot cheaper but the SSD's really add to the cost. 250gb just seems too small for me for OS, programs, games so I was thinking of two (1 for system/program files, 1 for games). Wondering what you guys have done for this?

PSU/Case: Disappointed to see MSY no longer stock Seasonic PSUs, these were a fav of mine. Happy for any suggestions nonetheless. The last rig I put together a couple years back used a HAF 922 case from Coolermaster which I really liked.

MB: I think this board might be overkill - looks like I can save $50. I value the quality wifi and extra USB3 ports in this mobo but I think I can save some money on this.

Would love to be as close as possible to $3k.

Purpose of PC will be for gaming, MS office, web browsing. Just want nice responsive systems.

Already have 24" monitors good to go.

Seems fine, I'd just say get 1 250gb ssd thou. I think ssds are very over rated. I went out and got a vertex 3 240gb and going from a Wd black caviar apart from boot times I hardly notice a difference. But that was when an 240gb ssd was $400, so if you can afford it get em. ssds these days are much cheaper. Tho maybe grab a 512 instead of 2x 250's.

Or you could run the 2 x 250's in raid 0 which would give you nearly 500GB but without seperate partitions.

Two small drives in raid can be cheaper that one single large drive, so check out the prices

128gb is enough unless you put thousands of games on it. 256gb with a larger 7200RPM drive is optimal.

Unless you play multiple games regularly you should only need at most 40gb for games on an SSD.

Thousands of games? Max Payne 3 was one of the best games last year and it was 30gb.

Unless you spend mega-bucks on a 512gb or 1TB SSD then you have to make decisions over what games you keep on it.

Anyway, this is what I'd build.

CPU - i5 3570k - $235
Cooler - Coolermaster Hyper 212 Evo - $43
Memory - G.Skill Ripjaws 1600mhz PC3-12800 16GBRL (4x4gb) - $125
Mobo - Asrock Z77-Extreme4-M - $123
Video Card - Gigabyte PCIE 3.0 GTX670 OC Edition 2GB - $443
Hard Disk - 1TB Seagate Barracuda 7200RPM - $79
SSD - 250gb Samsung 840 Pro Series 1 - $219 (Note, not the Series 2 model which is more expensive with minor performance differences, this is too cheap a system to spend on that).
Bluray - LG 14x OEM Burner - $93
Case - Silverstone TJ08E - $113
Case Fan - Antec TrueQuiet 120mm - $23
PSU: 520W Antec High Current Gamer - $93

$1589.

If you have to really hit that $1500 price point drop the 670 to a Gigabyte HD7950 3gb for $345 which will make the build $1491.

Do you really need the Blu-Ray burner?

Yeah my Steam folder is 205GB with about 25 game installed and nearly 30GB for BF3, certainly not thousands, a 250GB wouldn't cut it as my main.

I know what you mean Mack about picking and choosing which game stays, but **** downloading all the time when you just want a quick blast of another game, when you need a break from your favourite.

I've downloaded almost all my non-regular games onto my main mechanical drive (raid 0 drive). I've only got BF3, Far Cry 3, Black Mesa Source, Bastion, CS:GO and Football Manager on my SSD, that is 60gb all up and I could move all but FM and BF3 off the SSD anyway.

These Asrock mobos seem all the rage these days.

I like your build otherwise Mack, just not sure that the GTX is worth an extra $100 (googling people seem to prefer the 7950 at the same price, let alone $100+ difference)

You're right actually not sure why I threw the bluray writer in there - I can't even remember the last time I burnt a disc.

Also didn't even consider a micro case but why not I suppose.

Good food for thought, cheers.

RE: Storage, since I'm trying to stop the cost blowing out I guess it wouldn't be such a big deal to use the mechanical HD for additional games. Boot time would be the biggest benefit after all.

Did you type in the right model number? I haven't had an ATI card since my **** 5870 several years ago so maybe I typed the wrong one in when I was looking. Either way that build is cost effective enough that you can move around between the types.

If you take out the blu-ray you could even get that system with a Gainward/Palit/Galaxy 2gb GTX 680 for $1566.

Do they have to be exactly the same? You could drop down to the cheaper 7950 (and a non-K model CPU to save even more) on one and get a good 680 model on the other. The 7950 will do good at lower quality settings while the 680 PC can crank up the detail.

I'm still only using mechanical drives, 2 x 500GB SATA3 in raid 0 and one 2TB SATA3 as storage. Just never liked the idea of spreading too many installs/prog folders over multiple drives/partitions using Windoze...

Edit: have to agree on Nvidia as a preferred card though...

Ok yeah http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/598?vs=645 is starting to lean me towards the 670 GTX. It looks pretty neck and neck until you reach the bottom.

Actually tempted to consider 1x GTX 670 and 1x 7950 and benchmark the difference

Really? What for? There's not much in it either way so i'd just go identical systems personally.

nvidia cause the updates, drivers and software isn't terrible not because of some silly benchmark

Ok - revised build - I think its way better.

CPU Intel i5-3570K 227
MB AsRock Z77-Extreme4 135
RAM Patriot Viper 16G Kit 1866(8Gx2) 99
GPU Gigabyte N670OC 2G GTX 670 419
HDD1 Samsung 840 Series SATA3 (250GB) 195
HDD2 Seagate SATA3 94
DISC LG SATA Blu-Ray Combo 55
CASE Enermax Hoplite 122
PSU Antec HCG 520 83
Cooler Enermax ETS-T40-VD 57
WIFI TP-Link WN881ND 19

1505 (all parts from MSY except Enermax gear from ITestate)


I shall name the twins 'Red' and 'Blue'



Sacrificing the 2nd SSD lets me upgrade to the GTX and still keep within budget. Also saved money on the MB (cheaper to buy wifi card separately), disc drive and RAM.

Going micro-atx could save me another $20 on MB but I'd rather have more space for airflow / upgrade flexibility. A mid size tower with standard ATX should do me I think.

I might pay a little extra to upgrade to a modular PSU, currently the next thing I'm researching.

Also researching Seagate reliability.. I remember 2-3 years ago they were having major issues with their 1TB hard drives.

I'd get the coolmaster 912 advance case, much better airflow. 2x 20cm fans and a 12cm vs 3x 12cm fans on the case you mentioned.

http://www.myshopping.com.au/ZM--122152 ... dio_No_PSU

Ahh good call that's tempting, cheaper too.

Just learnt that Antec HCG PSU's now come in both modular and non-modular editions. MSY don't stock the modular editions though.

Also NEWSFLASH .. MSY actually have a call centre now, complete with call queuing. Amazing. Finally.

Yeah, that's a better option for a non-mini case than the enermax ones.

Another option might be the Antec Three Hundred Two.



Researching reliability is a waste of time. You can just as easily get a faulty Seagate as a faulty Hitachi as a faulty WD. It's just luck of the draw, the major three drive makers are as good as each other in relation to failures.

I realise that all manufacturers have failure rates, but that doesn't rule out greater than normal failures on particular makes and models.

Seagates 1tb has been particularly infamous: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/01/16/barracuda_failure_plague/

Its further discouraging that even last year Apple were performing widespread recalls on 1tb seagate drives.

I think these failures are reflected in pricing: ten years ago when the three players were Seagate, wd and Maxtor, Seagate was always priced highest. Now they're the cheapest by far.

Not to derail the thread, but its interesting discussion.

It is an interesting discussion but I just think apart from those specific example of a model failure (which could just as easily happen next time to another brand) there isn't a huge load of difference.

I'd probably just go with whatever the cheapest 7200rpm driver was in the size I wanted. My system has three seagate 1.5tb drives that have been going for years now, and the raid 0 is from drives even older.

Have decided to go for G.Skill Ripjaws-X 8gb 2133 kit instead, saving me $85 across both PC's. The more I look into it, the 16gb seems excessive and if anything I'm able to get faster timings at a lower price.

Also found that my local store stocks the modular version of the 520M (extra $30 across both PC's) which I'm going to go for for better cable mgmt.

Now looking at a mere $1,476 per PC.

Do higher timings even matter?

Either way, 8GB should be fine. I've got 12gb but only because I've got 6 slots in my motherboard and got a 2nd kit of 3x2gb cheaply.

Its true, higher timings make a miniscule difference at best, but given that the price diff between 2133 and the next speed down is $2 I don't see any reason to hold back.

Have ordered all parts for Friday pickup!

Two more changes:

Opted for GSkill ARES instead of RIPJAWS. Sticks are supposedly identical except for heatfins. The ARES is much more shorter and subtle which I prefer for airflow and heatsink clearance. Exactly same price.

vs

Also upgraded to a 480gb Sandisk Extreme SSD for 369. It alleviates my concerns that 250gb would be too small and I've been hearing complaints about the Samsung 940 series (in contrast to the now out of stock 930 series which was rock solid).

Will post pics of parts and final case(s) hopefully Friday or Saturday for the fun of it, then benchmark!

Yeah, the heatsinks on the ripjawas are ridic and completely pointless, but I don't have a problem with them in my build with the NH-D14, it was tight getting the 2nd set of 3 sticks in though as it was already installed. Either one is fine.

That's a nice price on the SSD. I was thinking about an upgrade and saving for a 512gb but decided against the upgrade because FC3 and BF3 will play fine on my machine.

I used the Ares with my last build and even they just got under my cpu cooler. I used a NZXT Havik 140. Worth a look as well as its in the price range you are working with and its very good.

Most of those heatsinks are just gimics. Just for looks.

I disassembled some (Kingston hyper X) and the heat sinks were just stuck on by double sided tape. The tape most likely dissipated 0 heat. In fact it would have made the chips hotter.

It best to chose ram based on size and convenience.

Choose ram that will fit, and not interfere with the CPU cooler.

^

Exactly my reasoning for choosing the Ares over the Ripjaws.

Not to mention the more neutral orange/bronze color that I think will suit the Asrock mobo more

Ripjaw heatsinks are directly attached to the chips using TIM. They are quite functional and I know what you are saying about the fins fouling on the air coolers. My NH-D14 only just managed to fit with Ripjaws on the most outer RAM sockets.

The solution to this is go custom loop water cooling.